DIY discussion - Increasing power to the G25 & G27 wheels
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267 posts in this topic

probably 3A is too low, better 5A...30V is ok, don't go over because some people had some issue with the usb port: it seems like if a too high voltage may altered the 5V reference of the usb, causing even failure of usb hub of the pc.

within the 30V seems to be safe.

check the temperature of the mosfet

 

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That's what i will buy for sure. This is just some kind of plug-in upgrade, not more than strip and weld cables right?
 checking the temperature of transistor, is there any way to do it? Just with my hand no?! (noob question xD)

Thank you so much

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:-D

sure, you have two ways:

- buy a 50$ thermocamera

- use your cheaper fingers....

BTW, I use a very empirical way: if you can stay with finger on the transistor for at least 5-10 seconds without too much pain, its temperature is below 50-55°C and it is safe for transistor (they blow when go over 70-80° or more)....not more than 10 seconds, because when you put your finger on transistor, you alter the heat dissipation (highter or lower, you can't know)

 

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angor, sorry to bother again. So, I'm buying right now the power supply. Should I choose a 28V/5A or a 30V/5A? higher risks to mess with the logitech g27 choosing for a 30V?

Thank you


 

Edited by Jolupereira
change an error

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Greetings angor and all of you who are still keeping this thread alive.  Seems like we made some monumental strides in this effort to mod the outdated g25's and 27's and probably the 29's but that's still to be determine I'm sure.  The real question is how much torque gain have we produce by this mod.  This is where I'd like to push this discussion even further.

We know that the original power supply for the g27 is rated for 24v @ 1.75a which equals to 42watts (v * amp = watts).  So what is the real torque rated for this wheel?  While searching online I found the following.

Exhibit A: This data was complied by it's author and experimenter I believe:  http://www.edracing.com/edr/Wheel-Torque.php

  • Logitech DFGT: less than 2.5 Nm
  • Logitech G25: 2.5 Nm
  • Logitech G27: 2.3 Nm
  • Logitech G29: 2.1 Nm - not a retail release version of wheel
  • Logitech G920 2.2 Nm
  • Fanatech GT3 v2: 2.6 Nm
  • Thrustmaster Tx: 3.9 Nm
  • Thrustmaster T500: 4.4 Nm
  • Fanatec CSW v1: 4.8 Nm
  • Fanatec CSW v2: 7.1 Nm

Exhibit B:  This youtube video shows this person attaching some sort of amp meter to the g25 and was reading the wattage pulled by the wheel has he turns it in force feedback.  Notice the meter reading between 40 and 43watts.  Let's all agree this is consistent to 42watts +/- : 

 

If I'm not mistaken the g25 uses the same 24v @ 1.75a power supply like the g27.  If I'm assuming this correctly then the total 42 wattage pulled by the wheel (shown in the vid) while in force feedback equates to 2.5Nm as depicted in the above chart.  My question is if the g25's power was modded to 30v @ 5a (as an example) would this mean that 30 * 5 = 150watts divided by the original 42watts is 3.57 which is 3 and half times more torque to the wheel's original 2.5Nm?  This would mean 8.75Nm total after the mod....as much as I'd like to believe this would be true I, however, think that's doubtful.

And just so we can compare, the Fanatec CSW v2 is rated at 7.1Nm as shown in the chart above.

so....LET THE DISCUSSION BEGIN!

Edited by simul8r

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Just found this at Logitechs website: http://support.logitech.com/en_hk/article/9004?product=a0qi00000069v2KAAQ

Product Name AC Adapter P/N Adapter Output Auto switching?*
DriveFX for Xbox 360 190211-A030 24V .75A No
Driving Force 190211-0030 24V .75A No
Driving Force EX 190211-A030 24V .75A No
Driving Force GT 190211-A030 24V .75A No
Driving Force Pro 190211-A030 24V .75A No
Driving Force Wireless 190211-A030 24V .75A No
G25 Racing Wheel 190542-0000 24V 1.75A Yes
G27 Racing Wheel 190542-0000 24V 1.75A Yes
MOMO Force 190211-A010 24V .75A No
MOMO Racing 190211-A030 24V .75A No
NASCAR for PC - - -
NASCAR for PS2 - - -
NASCAR for Xbox - - -
Speed Force 190211-0020 24V .75A No
Speed Force Wireless 190211-A030 24V .75A No
Wingman Formula - - -
Wingman Formula Force 190010-0000 20V 1.5A No
Wingman Formula GP - - -

* Auto switching power supplies can adjust an automatically identify the type of AC power input it is receiving, allowing the unit to function on 100~240V and 50~60hz AC circuits. This means the same AC adapter can be used worldwide.

Edited by simul8r

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I really doubt on that final 8.75Nm of torque. I don't think that the structural componentes of the g27 could even handle that amount of torque. Some users verified a gain of "only" 30% improve (which for me, as soon as my power supply arrives and if I manage to set i t up right, is more than enough).
simul8r , thank you for your post. Would like to see if anyone has more achievements and discoveries to share ;)

Edited by Jolupereira
orthography

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I didn't never measure the torque, I think is about 1,5-2x the original, not more.

Keep in mind that using an 30Vx5A does not mean you give 5A to the wheel...actually, supposing the internal resistance remain rought the same, 30V instead 24V mean you have 25% more Ampere, probably some more for less Voltage drop under load.

Roughly, 50% more power....And this is like what I've feel: about double speed without load, more torque during feedback, but not more over 1,5x.

 

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Guys, bad news. Just plugged the new power supply (30V/5A), and things didn't go as planned. 

First, the connection of the new PSU is the same dimension as the stock g27 (was surprised with that :) )

So, I connected it to the g27 and the things started to work funny. As soon as I plugged it in, no response from g27....just after about 10 seconds, it did the usual calibration (BUT WITHOU SHOWING THE REV LIGHTS)....but I felt the wheel really strange after this.  With windows software (similar to the attatched image), I tried to press some buttons to see how fast the wheel would react (and if it was detecting all the inputs). Only the rotation bar seemed to be working, and pedals, shifter buttons, etc...didn't work.  Seemed like they were unplugged. 

Runned wheelcheck and it was not centering like before (like the motors lost some power). After, I opened with LUT Generator for AC and the curve was completly nonsense. NO linearity at all

After this I connected the original power supply but (REALLY BAD NEWS NOW) it stayed the same, with the exactly same problem.  Sometimes pedals and other buttons work, sometimes not, but the feedback is completly different than before :(

Right now, since I'm no electronics wizard, I have my G27 disassembled, trying to figure out what went wrong...but no progresses so far

Any help?

 

300px-Game_control_panel.png

Edited by Jolupereira

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On 18.05.2018 г. at 11:57 PM, simul8r said:

Greetings angor and all of you who are still keeping this thread alive.  Seems like we made some monumental strides in this effort to mod the outdated g25's and 27's and probably the 29's but that's still to be determine I'm sure.  The real question is how much torque gain have we produce by this mod.  This is where I'd like to push this discussion even further.

We know that the original power supply for the g27 is rated for 24v @ 1.75a which equals to 42watts (v * amp = watts).  So what is the real torque rated for this wheel?  While searching online I found the following.

Exhibit A: This data was complied by it's author and experimenter I believe:  http://www.edracing.com/edr/Wheel-Torque.php

  • Logitech DFGT: less than 2.5 Nm
  • Logitech G25: 2.5 Nm
  • Logitech G27: 2.3 Nm
  • Logitech G29: 2.1 Nm - not a retail release version of wheel
  • Logitech G920 2.2 Nm
  • Fanatech GT3 v2: 2.6 Nm
  • Thrustmaster Tx: 3.9 Nm
  • Thrustmaster T500: 4.4 Nm
  • Fanatec CSW v1: 4.8 Nm
  • Fanatec CSW v2: 7.1 Nm

Exhibit B:  This youtube video shows this person attaching some sort of amp meter to the g25 and was reading the wattage pulled by the wheel has he turns it in force feedback.  Notice the meter reading between 40 and 43watts.  Let's all agree this is consistent to 42watts +/- : 

 

If I'm not mistaken the g25 uses the same 24v @ 1.75a power supply like the g27.  If I'm assuming this correctly then the total 42 wattage pulled by the wheel (shown in the vid) while in force feedback equates to 2.5Nm as depicted in the above chart.  My question is if the g25's power was modded to 30v @ 5a (as an example) would this mean that 30 * 5 = 150watts divided by the original 42watts is 3.57 which is 3 and half times more torque to the wheel's original 2.5Nm?  This would mean 8.75Nm total after the mod....as much as I'd like to believe this would be true I, however, think that's doubtful.

And just so we can compare, the Fanatec CSW v2 is rated at 7.1Nm as shown in the chart above.

so....LET THE DISCUSSION BEGIN!

It is impossible to have 8.75 Nm on G25...those plastic gears with plastic teeth even with stronger motor that is capable of this Nm range - will break on pieces. Another thing is that on higher Nm the plastic rail that slides and is used for end stop on 900 degrees will slip or break. 

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Jolupereira,

I'm really sorry to read your post.

I guess that the problem is not in the G27, but in the USB hub: I had seen strange behavior when I tried to exceed 30 V, but they disappeared when I reconnected the original supply.

Try to connect some other device to the same port and connect the g27 with original supply to another port.

One possibility, but almost remote, is that your G27 had one electrical component near to broke itself, and the extra voltage gaven it the final push

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@angor, I think you're right. Right now, my PCB is with a good electritian who said just the same: probably because of all the usage (>1000 hours) , and with the extra voltage, some component might have burned or "gave the final push". Let's see if I can have this repaired.
 

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