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Does iRacing still suck?

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iRacing is the only race sim you know of? Come on, get a sense of perspective. That reads like a marketing piece. 

Point me towards another.


NKP isn't popular enough to be a race simulator.


Simbin titles are treated like a game so if all you want is a race sim it can be frustrating and there is enough there that is nothing like a sim.


rfactor and rfactor 2, unfortunately it's the mod community that both make the game and destroy the experience. It's not simple to find content and with RF2 it's not simple to race with mods either. Many of the mods are not great, also the lack of quality in general is enough to break the immersion. I still hope that RF2 will get to the point where I can really enjoy it but Assetto Corsa might beat it to the punch. And there will always be those that treat it like a game so the best way for someone like me to get the sim racing experience is league racing which is a can of worms in itself. 


Maybe you should read what I wrote again, a marketing piece wouldn't point out flaws.


Please offer me some perspective. Point out where I'm wrong. I'll tell you the only major issue I have with iRacing is the expense, I'll be happy to be wrong especially if it costs less.

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You first state that people criticising the physics have "not driven real cars fast" when asserting to the quality of the physics in iRacing. This is then followed up later by "All I want to do is drive the race car, I'm not a race team, I don't want to setup my car, I wish there was a different way that just allowed me to be a race driver." and "I want to simulate real racing because I can't afford the real thing.", both suggesting you are naive as to the work that actually goes into racing and have never really experienced it yourself. This immediately suggests you are quite frankly talking out your arse when it comes to determining which physics are right and which are not. This especially flies in the face in how differently iRacing drives for example compared to rFactor and also to what the videos and literature on the iRacing say themselves, i.e. due to the lack of feedback you actually receive as a driver in iRacing, it is a very different experience to the real thing. This in my opinion, as for other sims, means that unless you are a racing driver, are involved in racing or have a relevant qualification which puts you in a position to discuss the physics pertinent to motor racing you shouldn't comment on which simulation does the better job, especially when you aren't accessing the actual coding involved. 


You state next that 'iRacing is not a game'. An interesting comment considering it clearly is a game. A classic ploy within gaming PR is to market a product as something other than just a 'game'. Such PR is more common these days with the movement away from 'classic' gaming, i.e. your Mario and Halo games, to more 'casual' offerings such as fitness games. You are right to state there is no other service like iRacing but that does not change the fact that it is ultimately, a game. 


The next point brings us back to the point that you can not afford to race in real life. Let's face it, it is too expensive for most people out there. But right after you say this you assert that iRacing is the thing that gets the closest to it. This once again comes back to your experience. You may have experience I am not aware of but since you never bothered to mention it I'll assume you don't. I do not understand how you can suggest one product is better than the other at simulating real racing when you have not done it yourself or, as I stated earlier, you do not have the relevent experience. It sounds even more stupid when from my basic, admittedly rookie-tainted, iRacing career I can most definitely state that the safety rating, sporting code and protest system are an incredibly poor alternative to what you can find in well-run leagues on other sims. In the TPS for example, I would not be punished for being 'divebombed' into T3 on Summit Point with a black mark on my skill and safety of a driver and I would most certainly see a punishment handed out for the driver committing the offence. However in iRacing my safety rating takes a theoretical hit and a protest would most certainly be unsuccessful based on what the Sporting Code states and based upon the written experience of much of the iRacing community on the forums. Furthermore, in real life racing situation, said driver would most certainly receive a reprimand from the stewards. 


If you were to race leagues, in rFactor as you suggest, you believe that you are somehow caused inconvenience by the software you might have to dowload for the league. I have never participated in any league, in any sim, that did not either have a centralised download service, like SimSync PRO, or did not set out the downloads in such a way that the only thing you would be required to do is click a link in the league or race information thread. You want to get extra content and race with pubs? Sure you are going to have to have to put a little effort in to get the content you are looking for, but league racing can be easily demonstrated to be completely different.


I agree with you about the myth that it is hard to get out of the rookie series. You just need to look at the data from the Beginner's Guide to see that you can easily get to supposedly higher standard series by just avoiding contact. I do question however the theory that high ranked drivers will be automatically better than lower ranked ones. I will readily admit to the fact that if you took 50 Rookies drivers and 50 C class drivers, the latter would be the safer and perhaps have the better race craft. However, the purchase of extra content, thus representing a commitment to the product is perhaps the more reliable indicator to who the idiots are. If you were to adjust for safety, I wouldn't be surprised to see a higher percentage of incurable smegheads driving the basic content compared to those driving paid for content. 


And finally. "iRacing is the only Race sim I know of". Rubbish and you know it. Your reply to my original post offers nothing but complaints of the pub mentality of Simbin titles, which is what you get driving with pubs, the content of rF2, a comparatively new game, and then criticism of the mods when you have repeatedly shown in your previous post that you don't have the experience to make valid criticisms and you once again ignore the fact that these things are clearly work in progress. I would also challenge anyone to complain about the content available in something like rFactor compared to iRacing while keeping a straight face. 


My take on iRacing is that it is a overhyped, expensive and glorified public racing server. However, much like your opinions that is completely and utterly stupid and retarded. iRacing is a beast of its own and a completely different experience to anything else. It is professionally set out, well-run and managed, is dedicated to providing some of the best sim action available and actually I think well worth the money, for me certainly who likes to take things seriously (taking into account how you can nearly race for free if you play it right). However, I find the extra content too expensive (can I even test it before I purchase it?), the races still resolving to public racing values and attitudes (i.e. some people want to race for real, keep it clean ect. but there will always be one idiot), and at this early stage a bit of a nightmare to drive. 


If you want a tl;dr, your original post was utter rubbish based on little fact or experience. The truth of the matter is that iRacing is completely different to other simulations in how it is run and managed and in that lie it strengths and weaknesses, thus trying to perform a direct comparison is stupid. A better approach is to highlight what it offers that is different to other sims rather than going "X is better than Y".

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James I'm 37 with wife and kids, not being able to afford 50k+ a year now to race does not disqualify me from having driven cars fast in my past or competing on some level. Surely you would know there are many ways to get a racing experience without the commitment to a season in a given racing class. My (prior) experience is mostly not able to be posted publicly but there is some legitimate experience there, I'm no V8 supercar driver sure but I have driven cars fast including (only a couple) race car experiences and a decent amount of Karts not that I'm using that as reference. I also have racing experience in team support roles, I have a good amount of paddock experience. But I think I have enough experience to have a reference point. And I didn't need to post this because what I posted including what you quoted implies it.


You do have some legitimate points.


IMO you clearly are as talented at talking crap as you perceive me to be. ;) 


You did misunderstand what I had said previously. It might be the way I wrote it but you kind of mashed up different thoughts. Yes I can say with a straight face that the "quality" not "quantity" of content in rfactor vs iracing breaks immersion for "me". League racing being a can of worms is also a separate complaint to the mod issues.


League issues are not platform specific, even IR has them.


In my first post I pretty much did point out where IR is different. Sure I made a comparison but it must be made because it is the only other way you can get something like what IR offers.


Anyway there is no need to argue about this. Surely our back and forward has settled that IR does not suck, it is unmatched in the service it offers. It is expensive, it is not perfect, there are cheaper alternatives that offer a different experience which may suit some people better. We seem to both agree on this and this doesn't conflict with my first post.


To be fair I should admit that the use of macro shifters is a fair complaint but not IR specific. The SR system isn't perfect sure but it is a good system and even if it gets it wrong at times it's not a deal breaker, surely the few people who constantly complain about this are the same people who would complain about neg rep on a forum and take the internet too seriously in general. SR balances out and can be a good indication of your ability to drive clean and avoid incidents historically. Of course it is a system that is also open to abuse but that abuse would be a violation of the SC, that might be hard to prove. Irating is a very good rating system in my opinion. Again I can see a legitimate complaint that you can be unfairly affected but it also levels out and it works, irating is a good indication of how you compare to others and it is great for match making and I can't think of a better system for a large group of racers.


And I would like to say that the complaints about IR like so many things are blown out of proportion in general. Yes if you step into a section of the IR forums you can seem overwhelmed by what seems to be a lot of complaints that also can seem like they are being ignored. That is until you take a shot of perspective and realise the ratio of people complaining vs the whole. And that more members disagree than agree with certain complaints. And even a short term member like me can see that historically IR has been constantly improving as a service in areas that specifically address previously raised concerns so it is clear that legitimate complaints are addressed. Perspective can also be the realisation that what an individual thinks is right may not be or that in the big picture the issue may be more complicated with other factors to consider.


It is also worth stating that it is an interesting time in sim racing with so much going on now and other work in progress titles now offering new features that iracing does not offer it is possible that in the not too distant future another service may offer a package that is superior as a whole. It is definitely something I considered before spending my cash in iRacing and will be something I will consider before every future purchase in iRacing. Everyone should because it is possible that we might drop a whole heap of cash now and in x months abandon iRacing because another title offers a complete package that is superior. I regret not getting into IR sooner, I don't regret the money I have spent on it now. Even if I abandon it next year which I doubt I still will not regret spending that money to enjoy what it offers me now. FWIW I have spent more on real life racing experiences that are over the same day and will most likely do it again but that's real.

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Now that that's out of the way I just want to say I agree with Darren.


I remember how I felt about Hard Driving back in the day, I remember how I felt the first time I played Gran Tourismo and how I had to share that with others.


It's a great time for sim racers, Darren is right not to dwell on the negatives.


I'm sure each of us has our own ideas about how certain titles can be better but look at what we have right now. IR offering an incredible online sim racing service that real people can simply jump on and race others all around the world. RF2 offering live track technology, it blows my mind that someone has even come close to doing this now. AC on the horizon that might offer the marriage of some of the best physics available with some of the best FFB available and great graphics with a good amount of content, if it can get the racing right this could be the go to title. And while in my eyes PCARS at the moment seems a bit simcade who knows where it will end up, it is possible that it could also be an incredible sim. Sure none are perfect, they all have their strengths and weaknesses but I think it's a great time for sim racing. I'm loving it and I can see it becoming my main passion if it hasn't already.

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