SIMTOOLS Version 2.0 released 1/9
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New motion software is now available from http://Www.simtools.us and https://www.xsimulator.net/community/ this is a plugin based system that is compatible with most motion systems and supports 6 interfaces/12 axis, scn interfaces, pololu jrk interfaces as well as Arduino and over 50 titles. Simtools 2 Is free for DIY builders. Also we are offering an upgraded version which includes "gamedash" support. Gamedash utilizes up to three interfaces and can run things from tm1638/Arduino boards to fans. The upgraded version will also support the new "GAMEVIBE" app. GAMEVIBE is full transducer(base shaker) support in a few different configurations GAMEVIBE is in development and is expected to be released soon. The software is based on a DIY community with amazing support.

Edited by Brucestephen

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On ‎8‎/‎22‎/‎2015 at 6:39 PM, Krassi said:

Just copy youtube link from the browser,not the code and paste it in the message. It becomes youtube video screen.

 

P.S.  Oh, I saw the link ,10x!

 

phew.  I pasted https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Yok0ToRrhc&feature=youtu.be

and let the forum do it's thing or Just take the 's' out of 'https://' when you paste the URL if that doesn't work.

 

Edited by KaydenX0rZ
brevity

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On 1/10/2017 at 0:54 AM, Brucestephen said:

This is a YouTube clip of my 6dof running on SIMTOOLS 2 a warm up lap then a slow one:-D

 

Well, great video. I am thinking I may build a "G-seat" using the SimTools. Sounds interesting to me.

On your 6dof rig, I watched your other videos just for clarity. I do not see too much movement on roll. It seems you would not get too much lateral g-effect on this. "Frame/Chasiss mover" solution like yours vs "Seat mover" solution is always an interesting topic. For Frame/Chasiss mover like this one, lateral g-effect is yielded by roll whole body (frame) in order to using gravity to generate lateral-g. So large degree of roll is required. I understand to build full motion of 6dof is not cheap. To me "seat mover" solution is far more effective on this regard. 

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@Joe Extraknow you do not get much g force with a simulator, not even the big commercial ones this a fallacy, if you do it is for a very short duration usually less than 1 sec. you can hang there but its still only 1g. the trick is to fool the mind and lucky for us that takes little work. in some of the early videos there is no roll initiated due to development at the time. i find roll in large increments to feel fake, it almost snaps me out of my fantasy. the best "feeling" i get when its all tuned properly is a connection to the car and track. By this i mean I can feel the balance of the car(over/understeer) through the turn while also feeling the throttle and brake through the rig. on top of that I get the "candy" as i call it. the CANDY is all the little stuff like rumble on curbs, bumps and heave on straights and slight contact with other cars(drafting etc.). then add in the sensations from an osw and bass shakers.

one of the deciding factors to look at is the speed at which the rig is able to perform its movement. anything less than 400mms for racing is too slow. The big rig movements look cool when your watching but feels fake in the rig. the best is short and fast. its more believable. a lot of guys like the seat mover option. the problem with the seat mover is the fact that the wheel and pedals move toward and away from you... this is not real. Also it is hard to get the feel of the cars balance with a seat mover/shaker.I would go g seat before seat shaker for sure. A good full frame rig will give you the sensations at your hands and feet without affecting the distance and angle to these items.

as far as the g seat i have little experience with this but it looks like a great piece of equipment. it operates by fooling the brain with pressure on the body.

p.s. the motion rig was built for less than $1500. and about 30hours work. but remember diy doesnt come with warranty or customer support. those can be very valuable if you have issues.

20160623_153204.jpg

Edited by Brucestephen

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6 hours ago, Brucestephen said:

@Brucestephen

Amazing for $1500 with 30 hours only. Great job indeed. I bet most of people probably could not do it for that money and limit of time. Wonder what is the power of those motors, 1Kw?

On lateral-g force effect of "Seat mover vs Frame mover", I respectfully disagree in some of aspects.  Basically the principle of 6DoF movement applied to a racing car motion simulator is to generate the g-effect with gravity (need full motion - large degree of roll, pitch, yaw, and heave). If this is not a purpose, then I do not see a strong reason why have a frame to move in 6DoF. A car does "not" do that (actually dose in principle - in a minor way), not like a plane or a boat. (wait, dirt rally car maybe?). Anyhow thanks for sharing your views and your rig.

 

If for shaking, bounce and impact, etc, a concern I have is the resolution with such solution. 

On seat mover solution with high resolution SCN5 actuators connected seat directly, without any moving parts in the middle, the detail resolution is just amazing and fast, very accurate. The video below demonstrates this aspect:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TwPi_qzXhJU

In comparison, if I look at the 6DoF frame mover with motors, there are many moving parts connected and angled, and also I am not even sure if the motor has such resolution (by looking at the videos, I doubt). If so, how can such detailed resolution be transmit to the seat without absorb/damped out:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ypbe6ngd-JE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fmVtUYuGOZc

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by Joe Extraknow

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You guys know a lot more about this than me. However, Bruce's reply makes a lot of sense to me. It's logical (the way I see it) that this 6dof system can simulate the movements and impacts of/on a car a lot better than a seat mover. Having heave as well and no change in distance between you and the pedals/steering wheel is a bonus as well...hey, should actually defend the seat mover concept here ;-)

When it comes to speed I con only say these SCN5's got me immersion galore. The dbox actuators are a bit slower and some have claimed that's not good enough. I, on the contrary, really enjoyed the ride on a dbox rig as well.

The thing is, I was using a static rig...and I simply don't know anything better. The number 400mm/s doesn't actually sound crazy, even though it's soo much more than what the SCN series can get you. To me it's more the other way around, it's amazing how these relatively slow SCN's can get you so much immersion.

The SCN's won't even do 400mm on a seat mover without occupant. Then you got the issue with high brake pedal forces working against the actuators. Reducing the vertical distance between the centre of the u-joint and your cheeks to a minimum is the only thing you can do here...another bonus for the 6dof rig.

Wouldn't it be great if there were guys providing assistance and 6dof motion kits like with the OSw?

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any motion is good motion. I'm not dogging any system. A lot of what I explained is just personal observation. that said. I have a ton of resolution. 6 interfaces running at 4000 calculations per second.500000baud rate. plenty of resolution. I am also using hall sensor pots with gear reduction. I get rumble strips and brake chater. And to be honest once you experience heave there no going back. I can get clutch surge by placing my foot loosely on the gas. the rig surges forward and backward making my foot hit the gas making it move more and more. Until i either press the gas or lift to stop it, like in a real stick shift. A 6dof also gives you sway combined with traction loss, this is where "feeling the balance" comes from. in flight slow movement is good but in a car especially a race car fast and short. Where the problem lies on my end is motor strength. you can do as i have done and offset some weight with dampers. this means cheaper motors, but the dampers are dampers so they resist movement, this slows you some. but its really a negligible amount @Thirsty I never thought about the brake resistance issue you explained above.thanks for the videos @Joe Extraknow good watch:-D

 

BTW this video you pulled from my channel is my 2Dof fullframe it is not on my 6dof. the 2dof is retired now it was my first stab at motion.

 

Here it is in action. the motor cell my seem a little out of sync do to it being driodcam ip.

 

Edited by Brucestephen

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9 hours ago, Brucestephen said:

@Joe Extraknow BTW whats with the helmet? sry but i gotta know. is it wired or something?

With helmet on, for 3 laps only my head sweat all over. Increditbly quite work out on my seat mover (my helmet is very tighten/small and far less O2 inside I guess. Today GT racing helmet can be air conditioned). BTW, the strength of seat mover solution is the strong g-effect simulated by body roll and body muscles tension and subconscious mind due to dynamically change distance between your body and steering wheel, and to fixed screen, so that your body will fight to balance subconsciously (keep in center--- screen center) while cornering just as if drive a real race car (plus with DD wheel and ~90lb foot brake force pedals you will not get faster, but you will get tired soon):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iDgo2YOHifo

 

 

Edited by Joe Extraknow

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@Joe Extraknow nice video. it looks like a fun rig. I agree with dd wheel adding a ton of feedback/immersion. Pedals are next for me. I will prolly buy a set rather than build, I do wanna go with hydraulic tho. do you use bass shakers/simvibe?  I have mounted small daytons to my seat at the corners then i also have a 50w aura in the center of the rig. sucks when i race late at night because they disrupt the house so I have to turn them off.

 

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@Brucestephen

I use the Simvibe, with all 7 transducers, but it seems to me that only two are worth: under-seat and on pedals. The two on the rear chassis/frame are not effective at all, due to fact of that my seat is overwhelmed by the actuators.

I have the earliest HPP hydraulic pedals and upgraded with his latest pressure sensor (5000 psi). I measured the max brake foot pedal force is about 70 - 80 lb, above which the pressure sensor no longer register reading (saturated). Not too bad. A real GT car max brake foot pedal force is from 120 to 150 lb. HE ultm pedals maybe even higher, but it is loadcell though.

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Hi Bruce, I was wondering if you knew if simtools 2.0 would fix my issue. After running for about 15mins my rear left actuators(scn6-100) stops working. all the others continue to work. to fix this I have to power down and then re initialise the software and its good to go again, spoke to my supplier and he said it has safety stop feature and then it might be over loaded. ive gone a diet to try and fix this but I would like to continue easting and still enjoy my sim. any ideas?

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6 hours ago, jonston said:

Hi Bruce, I was wondering if you knew if simtools 2.0 would fix my issue. After running for about 15mins my rear left actuators(scn6-100) stops working. all the others continue to work. to fix this I have to power down and then re initialise the software and its good to go again, spoke to my supplier and he said it has safety stop feature and then it might be over loaded. ive gone a diet to try and fix this but I would like to continue easting and still enjoy my sim. any ideas?

Johnston,

version 1.3 is still available and version 2 has a demo I believe. First I would check to see if the unit is overheating. If it is a cooling solution may be the ticket. If that doesn't help then possibly try one of the simtools and see if that eliminates the issue. Both versions of simtools are compatable with scn actuators. Also check the cable swap them around etc. to see if you can duplicate the issue. Hope this helps buddy.

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