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ECCI vs HPP?

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So, I'm currently using a set of T500 pedals with a Bodin load cell.  I'm thinking of upgrading to a higher quality pedal.  I'm currently looking at ECCI 6000 USB 3 pedal standalone, or possibly breaking the bank and doing the HPP's.  I talked to Mark from HPP on the phone for a good 30 minutes last week and got lots of good information.  I'd most probably be looking at the PRX SE version.   I'm trying to justify what, if any, advantage there is to the HPP's over the ECCI.

 

Has anybody had both?  What are your thoughts?

 

I'm curious if there any mounting issues with the ECCI on the Obutto Ozone cockpit as well.  Size?

 

Thanks!

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I own the Ozone , the ECCI 3 pedal & the HPP PHT 2 pedal set . They both have their merits , but if you want to use the ECCI 3 pedal in a Ozone it will be cramped . The ECCI are some of the best & toughest pedals made but they are BIG ! If you were going for a 2 pedal set they will work great , be bullet proof & last for years . I have a set that I still use 4-5 days a week on oval racing & they are 6 years old ... no issues except for a pot change . The pedals  didn't even need new pots , I changed them because I was worried about their age & usage . ECCI is a little dated compared to todays offering , but well worth the money & you will not be disappointed if you choose them ! You also have a ton of adjustability with the ECCI from angle , height , distance , spring adjustments & pedal spacing .
 
Now for the HPP PRX SE . I have no idea about them because they are the newest offering . As soon as my finance's settle down I will be ordering a set ! Mark is a very Awesome guy & has a very unique design approach that is Brilliant ! The 2 pedal PHT is as bullet proof  as you can get ! I use them with road race & F1 style racing at least 4 times a week ! The feel is incredible , accurate & offers consistency in every lap without fail ! He is using a unique throttle pot & a special pressure transducer that are bullet proof as well !  You will not go wrong with HPP & the PRX series will offer you a flexible mounting solution that can be a floor mounted set or converted to a GT hanging style ... whichever you prefer ! The PRX also offer a ton of adjustability from angle , height , distance , spring adjustments & pedal spacing .
 
Another factor that is argued quite a bit is resolution on the output from the circuit board . ECCI is a 10 bit board while the HPP is a 12 bit Bodnar board . ECCI has done a Great job with using a 10 bit board & offers a very stable calibration . Although the ECCI only has 1003 steps it still offers great control & very smooth output . The HPP output offers 4096 steps , offers great control & a bit smoother control due to higher resolution . To be honest I do prefer the HPP on a road course due to brake/throttle modulation on corner entry , mid corner & corner exit . I find my laps times are about a .050 to .100 of second quicker than the ECCI . Not a huge difference & some of the guys that use my rig(s) while I am working like both pedals about the same . But everyone does love the HPP brake , it has a very natural feel about it .
 
Another HUGE PLUS with using these 2 companies is the customer service that you will receive !!! Both John Pribble with ECCI & Mark with HPP are the Absolute Best when it comes to customer service , period !!! I have never had to wait any longer than 24 hours for either of them to respond to a concern that I have had & they have always taken care of my needs !!!
 
In this case due to the Ozone chassis I would recommend the HPP PRX SE due to the pedal box size constraint & flexible mounting options . Others my argue , but I have had my Ozone since 2009 & the HPP just works better with it .
 
Good Luck with your decision !

 

Billy

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Thanks Billy.

 

I talked to John at ECCI last night and I was able to confirm that I can get a set of the pedals with a narrowed rear bracket, it just requires that it be hard mounted, which these pedals always will be for me.  I also had the same concerns over the pedal resolution, though it's no less than what I'm using now.

 

Right now I'm torn.  I want the HPP for various reasons and the mounting convenience, but the price is just hitting the point where I don't think I can justify it.  Still not sure what I'm going to do.

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Don't let the resolution worry you , I only mentioned it to be as honest as I could in my opinion of the 2 sets & the difference really isn't that noticeable  . The ECCI pedals are Great & will be trouble free ! I actually own more than 1 set . I have a desk rig that uses the 3 pedal set with the PMB II brake & I have not touched that set of pedals in 4 years . They are only used a few times a week , but they have never failed !

 

Which brake are you considering for the ECCI ? They offer a PMB II , a Race Brake Stage 2 & 3 . I own all 3 & my favorite is Race Brake Stage 2 for overall racing ! You can also get different springs to give it the feel that you want ! Ask John about the different spring combos that can be done & what to expect from them .

 

You can actually remove the front / rear brackets on the pedals & mount them using the same holes that the brackets were using to the Ozone pedal tray . I have not done this , but I have seen pictures of it done & they say it worked Great !

 

Good Luck with your decision & post your choice when you decide please .

 

Billy

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Wow, I have a few small comments, but Billy just nailed it.  You couldn't have a better response.

 

I just sold my ECCI 6000GTS pedals; they are built like a tank (27lbs!!).  Quite adjustable and you can order a number of upgrades and ECCI customer services is fantastic.  I really liked the hanging brake pedal on the ECCI setup, but personally, I prefer a non-hanging throttle.  

 

I plan to order the HPP 2 pedal PRX SE as I don't ever use the clutch.  

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I looked into both sets (and others as the HE Pros, ARC, etc) and ordered the 2 pedals HPP PRX SE for the reasons stated above by oldschoolsq in addition of other pointers by forum members.  Here is a review I found that was impressive even though it doesn't include the ECCI pedals as comparison but includes my current Fanatec CSP V2s...  http://www.simracingmachines.com/Reviews/HPP2014

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My plan at this point is to go with the ECCI.   I use the clutch quite a bit so I'll be getting the 3 pedal setup.  Haven't made my final decision on this yet, but I may just go with the PMB-II setup for now and I'll order the stage 2 upgrade kit (or springs as you mentioned) to stiffen it up if I feel it needs this later.  Not sure how I want to do that yet.

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The stiffer the better. It´s a catch 22 because you build leg muscles ;). One drawback of not using a loadcell or pressure transducer is that if you race a lot of different cars and want to change how much pressure to apply for full brake you must physically go in and change rubbers, adjust pot arms or short calibrate for less brake force of course. Whereas with loadcells/pressure transducers all you do is go into the calibration tools and calibrate for the max pressure I want. I find this very convenient particularly for games with limited options for setting up the pedals. Assetto Corsa where you can´t adjust brake pressure for example.

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Quote

"One drawback of not using a loadcell or pressure transducer is that if you race a lot of different cars and want to change how much pressure to apply for full brake you must physically go in and change rubbers, adjust pot arms or short calibrate for less brake force of course. Whereas with loadcells/pressure transducers all you do is go into the calibration tools and calibrate for the max pressure I want. I find this very convenient particularly for games with limited options for setting up the pedals. Assetto Corsa where you can´t adjust brake pressure for example."

 

 

You can do the same calibration trick with the ECCI pedals without having to change any mechanical parts . Just do a calibration , apply the amount of force that you want & click done ! I have been doing this for years with ECCI pedals .

 

Cheers,

Billy

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Well, I just couldn't see spending an extra $500 for just hydraulics.  I ordered my STANDARD 3pedal ECCI's with the stage 2 brake upgrade this morning.  I talked to Jim and he has a narrow bracket/base (same width front to back, instead of tapering out wider) that he'll ship to me once he has them available later this coming week.  If the width is a problem, I'll have the narrower base to change to when it's here.  I'm mounting 1" thick oak board to the plate, and then I'll drill/mount the pedals into that board.  I wanted the option to go back to standard width if/when I change my cockpit setup.

 

Thanks for all the help guys, especially oldschoolsq.

 

As for the cockpit, I'm thinking about building a cockpit using 80/20.  I just have to figure out how to do it and how I want to design it.

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Congratulations on your decision ! I know that you will enjoy them for years to come ! I am glad that I was able help you !
 
Tip - take your time with setting them up , especially the spring settings & get the feel just right ! After you do that just  run practice laps to find the braking/accelerating thresholds . Once you do that I think you will find that your laps will be very consistent &  lap times will be faster . The biggest learning curve is setting them up to find the feeling that you are comfortable with . Also read your instruction manual , it covers the springs & the spring mounting locations on the clutch & gas ( light , medium & heavy ) , I run my clutch & gas pedal in the medium mounting hole then I adjust the spring tension for feel . I am often surprised at the people that have complained about the feeling of the gas pedal being to light on the EECI & never knew that there was adjustments available . Most people never read the instruction manual ! LOL

 

There are 2 springs on the brake pedal , the top one is a pre load & the lower one is the primary . Play with these until you find the perfect feel , it will take some time BUT once you find the sweet spot there is NO looking back ! You will find that you can drive way deeper in the corner than before & control the mid corner push by modulating the brake just a tad . It takes practice but you will get it & you will be faster once you do !
 
If you have any questions on the adjustment I will be more than happy to help if I can & John is really the man with the answers !
 
Good Luck & post some pictures when you get them installed ( also post pictures if you do a 8020 rig) please !
 
Cheers ,
Billy

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ECCI's arrived and are setup.  Worked great out of the box.  No adjustments necessary.  HOWEVER, I've been back and forth through the ringer for controller configuration.  I have 4 USB devices and right now my primary sim racing and mods are done via rF1 engine games that only recognize up to 3 controllers maximum and inevitably only the first 2 are configurable.  I had 3 before with the T500wheel/pedal, shifter, and button box, but with the pedals splitting from the wheel, that makes it 4.

 

The answer was vJoy and URJ  I  created 2 virtual joysticks.  Pedals and shifter on the first, button box on the second.  Wheel came in 3rd.  No need for me to make adjustments for it as I always use default.  I can now use 4 devices as 1.

 

rF2, AC, pCars, seem to be fine.

 

Other than the obvious build quality improvements, the pedal feel, modulations, etc, feels the same as the T500 pedals to me.  From a day to day sim racing perspective, I've probably "waisted" my money, but for having hardware that is more easily maintained and pretty much bullet proof, I think it's well worth the money.

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Thanks for the update !

 

I would play around with the brake spring adjustments & see if makes the brake better , but if your happy with it now there would be no need . I know that I reduced my lap times after working with the springs & finding the sweet spot .

 

Good Luck !

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The brake feels awesome and wouldn't change anything.  I'd say it's just as good as the Bodin load cell I put on the T500's.  The biggest difference is that I just have more pedal travel to play with.  Ultimately I wouldn't say one is better than the other.  My "much better lap times" days was a year or so ago when I got the load cell and could brake into a turn 5-10 feet farther without locking them up doing so.  Keep in mind too, most of my racing is stock car oval based racing right now.  I do quite a bit of offline road racing.  I'm not seeing any time improvement, as I'm already hitting my braking/skill limit.  My main goal with the ECCI's was to get the durability and easier maintenance.

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