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F1 2010 Sim Enough?

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come on guys, some of you are exagerating a bit. the game is totally playable.

its not FVA, rFactor or iRacing. thats for sure. its a GAME, but its quite fun and totally enjoyable.

this is what i did to tweak it a bit:

- use around 200 degrees rotation for my g25 on the logitech profiler.

- set deadzones to 0, linearity to 50% and saturation to 80% ~ 100% in the game controls settings

- use the FOV mod to get a closer view (i'm using 35 on a 24 inch screen)

- turn off all aids and AI to legendary

- move brake bias to 60% front ( i can lock my front wheels under braking)

- dont expect the most realistic computer simulation experience, but expect a challenging f1 game

i for one am enjoying this game and i'm sure it will get better with time (patches and mods).

anyway, if you were expecting a SIMULATION from codemasters, i guess the blame is on you, not on the game. have fun.

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I'm enjoying it, what time I've gotten to put into it.

In particular I like the tuning options or the option to just have the pit chief take care of it. Reminds me of GTL. Sometimes you just don't want to get into that, or don't have time for it. I also like the transition from pit to track during races and when tuning on a time trail challenge. No interruptions. The pit limiter seems stuck on automatic though, unless I'm doing something wrong.

Graphics are fine, better than most sims. Framerate does seem a little low, but I figure I just need to tweak some. Certainly playable, but not what I'm used to on pc.

My biggest issue so far is actually the load time. It's crazy long. I don't mind it so much going into a race setting, but it shouldn't take this long to get out of the game entirely. If something comes up and you need to duck out of the game before a race is done, or just after, it's going to take you a while to exit properly.

Shifting does seem slow, but then that could easily be driver error since I'm still getting used to this.

In general, no surprises and I got what I paid for. More serious presentation than Grid or Dirt 2, and I'd say much more realistic than either of those. Plus you aren't skating around like you do in Grid. No obnoxious driver chatter like in Dirt 2 and communication from the pit chief is constructive, not chatty. Looking forward to more time in the seat learning the tracks.

*asking for a refund from the publisher is a little silly unless you bought directly from them. If you didn't buy it direct, then they didn't sell you the game, they sold it, or licenses, to the retailer you gave your money to.

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This game isnt a sim, but to me that is mainly because of the FFB, it doesn't simulate the forces being put on the car, which other games/sims do. Hell even Dirt 2 does it, perhaps thats the difference that in Dirt 2 you're jumping through the sky and powersliding around bumpy dirt tracks, but you can feel the wheels losing traction on the dirt.

F1 2010 has nothing like that, you put your foot down full throttle and it does nothing to the steering, you brake hard and you feel nothing at all through the wheel, change down gears, or up gears... nothing felt at all. When it comes down to it all the force feedback system in F1 2010 does is provide a centre spring, and rumbles over curbs, doesnt even move when you crash into a wall.

If they fixed that, it would be so much better, i find this game harder to play than FVA because i havent a clue what the car is doing. This game would likely be better just playing it with a gamepad as it is.

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I have been playing the career mode and like it. It is easily worth the purchase on STEAM for pc, in my opinion, unless you only like to drive full on simulations. This is not a full on sim such as iRacing--which should really be no surprise to anyone who reads this site. F1 2010 really is Dirt 2 with Formula 1 cars in many ways. Fun, easy handling, good AI, great graphics etc. The handling is fun and it is based on a physics model but not like a full sim would be. There is not too much low speed power on oversteer/traction issues, even with traction control fully off. Brakes don't lock up to any great extent, even with ABS off. So with no driver aids it is still easy to handle if you regularly drive the hardcore simulations (even if you aren't that great at them).

My first race I had all driver aids off except for the racing line and I had set the AI on legendary (the highest difficulty). I was in the Torro Rosso and placed 3rd in a ten lap race. I did spin out after hitting a low speed curb while on the power too much. Admittedly, the racing line is a driver aid that helped a lot but with all other aids off it wasn't too hard to do well.

I think the single player game is fun (the race was immersive) but the AI challenge may not be huge in career mode once you learn the tracks. Being in a slower car, I thought I was going to struggle more with the top cars. Maybe the differences in lap times between the best cars and the slower ones aren't that great in the game?

Still, the race was fun and I had done a fair amount of practice laps and even with the racing line on I ended up some 13 seconds behind first place after spinning so I suppose there will be some challenge with the AI. I also did some time trial laps. The tracks I have tried looked great. Monaco was very cool--best version of it I have seen in a game. Tearing through the streets felt like watching Senna's pole position lap video.

I guess I would say my early impressions can be summed up as-- a fun, immersive title, though not a full on simulation certainly. F1 2010 feels how I think the average person would imagine an F1 car to handle--super fast, with loads of grip but still possible to overdrive it and screw up on occasion. As a race fan, I imagine F1 cars to be much more of a handful than they are in this game--like the mods out there for other sims and like iRacing no doubt will be. But that doesn't make this game any less fun--at least so far!

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Should have preordered on Steam for $35, that's a bargain.

You guys do realize that if this were a perfect sim with all car, track and physics details down pat that you would never win in career or grand prix mode, right? Similarly, your times wouldn't rival that of the real drivers.

CM went for a driver-simulation perspective to give players a glimpse of what it's like to be an F1 driver---not so much what it's like to drive the actual race car on a perfect representation of a real track with accurate physics. That's the angle of simulation, as with many games/sims. If it were a completely accurate F1 sim, players would always place last---no matter how good you are in a sim. There's no way you could win against even the lowest rated F1 driver, much less the cream of the crop.

Be careful what you wish for. If they had pulled that off instead, there would be no end to the cries about the difficulty and frustration.

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There is one thing that bothers me. I suspect few, if any people have actually driven F1 cars around the tracks depicted in the game. Codemasters have at least enlisted the experience of someone who has. In fact I seem to remember Antony Davidson saying that driving some of the hard core PC sims was more difficult than driving the real deal. This lack of real world experience on the part of players and designers makes it harder to judge the accuracy of the game, particularly the handling in my view.

Regards,

Paul

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Should have preordered on Steam for $35, that's a bargain.

You guys do realize that if this were a perfect sim with all car, track and physics details down pat that you would never win in career or grand prix mode, right? Similarly, your times wouldn't rival that of the real drivers.

CM went for a driver-simulation perspective to give players a glimpse of what it's like to be an F1 driver---not so much what it's like to drive the actual race car on a perfect representation of a real track with accurate physics. That's the angle of simulation, as with many games/sims. If it were a completely accurate F1 sim, players would always place last---no matter how good you are in a sim. There's no way you could win against even the lowest rated F1 driver, much less the cream of the crop.

Be careful what you wish for. If they had pulled that off instead, there would be no end to the cries about the difficulty and frustration.

This is wrong, i am a fairly new sim racer (less than 2 months since i got a wheel) and on FVA (the ferrari simulator) i was able to match felipe massa's record time, along with that many of the sim racers beat his time, with the best being a full 1.3 seconds faster, on a very short track.

I am no faster on F1 2010 than i am using FVA or Rfactor's top F1 mods, both of which are far more realistic in terms of car handling, forces applied and skill level. Yes FVA is harder, requires more precise braking, steering, throttle control by a fairly big margin, but the FFB system gives a lot more information to the driver to get a feel for the car, and with that you can have confidence in what you are doing.

F1 2010 when it spins out it pivots from a central point, this makes it a LOT harder, and a lot less realistic in terms of reacting to the car spinning out, the fact is that it spins out at times where you dont expect it.. When a car spins out, it should not feel like its spinning around a pole that has been place through the middle of the car, the back end should slide out with the weight of the back of the car. That is an example of where F1 2010 is not easier than a normal sim, yet still less realistic, and far from real life. A lot of players are very proficient with the sims, and would be able to more than just compete.

Don't forget, that F1 drivers do those times while being subjected to massive forces, Mr precise fingers sitting in his comfy chair doesn't have to deal with that, he can just concentrate on nailing his laps in the comfort of his seat, so its alot easier for Mr precise fingers to match/beat their times.

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This is wrong, i am a fairly new sim racer (less than 2 months since i got a wheel) and on FVA (the ferrari simulator) i was able to match felipe massa's record time, along with that many of the sim racers beat his time, with the best being a full 1.3 seconds faster, on a very short track.

Don't forget, that F1 drivers do those times while being subjected to massive forces, Mr precise fingers sitting in his comfy chair doesn't have to deal with that, he can just concentrate on nailing his laps in the comfort of his seat, so its alot easier for Mr precise fingers to match/beat their times.

These statements prove my point, and that there is no simulator. None of the approach the real thing. If you can do what a real driver does, then the "sim" is pushing you to be better than you would be in the real car--if you could even get it off the line.

Those additional forces a real driver is subjected to can only be mimicked in some way in a game. Another reason you can't have a true simulator.

F1 2010 simulated what they wanted to---the driver's perspective. It's not possible to get the car, track and physics right and have a player competitive with the real drivers. If you get the same times, then the game isn't a real simulator.

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You dont get my point, ofcourse a sim is different to the real thing, i'm saying that a race driver is different to a gamer, its a different skillset. Simulations, however accurate to real life are still games at heart. The F1 2010 game in no way resembles accurate real life car physics at the slightest, where as the ferrari simulator is very close, its the closest thing we would get without being in their top of the line driver simulator, which is the closest thing you will get without being in a real open wheel car. That simulators physics are true to life, it is difficult but driveable, taking it to the limit takes extreme precision and skill, but its still a game.... you can still sit on your ass and play it for hours and hours and hours practicing and perfecting.

A lot of people have it in them to drive at a top level, practice is one of the most important aspects in any venture. While driving to a certain extent is a natural skill, alot of it is something that is developed from practice. You are putting F1 drivers on a pedastal, like they are some superhumans when they are not.. They are a bunch of clearly talented guys, who are very physically strong and fit, whilst having had the practice and perhaps a natural talent for driving, with all that thrown together they are also the lucky ones who knew the right people, found the right sponsers, or had the right support to get them there. There are likely more skilled and more talented new drivers that will never get the chance, many many of them.

Now, if you gave F1 2010 an accurate physics model, something more difficult that required more skill but more importantly was closer to life, it can be close to life without being overly hard... Lets say for example you give FVA physics/driving to F1 2010. Firstly you attune yourself to the car while learning the track, this really will not take much more time than the current game, it took me quite some time to learn bahrain before i could even post a proper time, when you have done that you will need to spend some more time getting up to speed. After that you can race, you will not be any slower than you are in F1 2010 with its easy to drive and unrealistic physics (My melbourne best time in Rfactor Fsone 2009, which wasnt a perfect lap was 1.28, where as i was pulling a late 1.27 in qualifying in F1 2010 in a lotus).

If in the event that you would not be fast enough to drive that kind of simulation physics against the AI you would have these options.

1. Turn on some driving aids, traction control, ABS and Stability control would make it much easier, much like F1 2010 but still alot more realistic.

2. Lower the AI difficulty, so they are slower too.

I'm not saying that if you put me in the FVA simulator around some track that i could beat an F1 driver i know that i could not, but i can drive the car well enough to compete with a bunch of AI drivers in an F1 game. Lastly - if you put Gregger huttu in FVA he would beat an F1 driver i have no doubt, regardless of the fact that he would never be able to do it in a real car.

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Id like to add that, despite the physics, FFB, the AI posting fake times, the bugs, badly optimised and crazy long loading times, the fact that it doesnt respond nice to the 400degrees steering rack (that a real f1 car would have), the punctures you get in every race, the badly implemented "always gets it wrong" penalty system, the ai not having any fuel so racing at qualifying pace in the race, the AI cars that cheat by not pitstopping to win the race..... i could go on.

Despite all that, i do enjoy the game and i really have had fun playing it, i have become quite consistant and fast and it does immerse you fairly well into the F1 world. I will likely finish my first year career and see where i go from there. though learning to drive it has totally trashed my ability to play Fsone 2009/FVA academy properly, i could barely keep the things on the track for the first lap or so due to having dialed myself in to F1 2010.

Last words, F1 2010 isnt a sim, but it isnt for the wrong reasons, they could have made it a sim and dimmed it down to make it easier to be consistant (Gran turismo? or any sim with heavy driving aids on) and then kept both crowds happy. F1 2010 oversteer/spin mechanics are horrible, the car spins very fast on its central point and it can't be countered other than braking to slingshot you in the other direction, this makes it both more difficult and vasly more unrealistic than the hardcore sims.

But aye, i do actually quite like it.

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You are putting F1 drivers on a pedastal, like they are some superhumans when they are not.. They are a bunch of clearly talented guys, who are very physically strong and fit, whilst having had the practice and perhaps a natural talent for driving, with all that thrown together they are also the lucky ones who knew the right people, found the right sponsers, or had the right support to get them there.

Maybe not superhuman, but darn close. They experience time and space differently than the rest of us, I'm convinced of it. That goes for rally drivers too, and others.

You don't get sponsorship without proving you deserve it. Sure, the best possible driver in the world might not even have a drivers license. The best possible basketball player may not have ever taken a shot. The best possible cyclist may not even know how to ride a bike. Opportunity does play into it, but that doesn't mean that any basketball player can simply practice and be another Jordan. Race drivers DO practice, they do lap after lap but it doesn't mean they could mach Schumacher in his prime just by doing that and having sponsorship.

Same goes for people simply doing laps. There's more to being the cream of the crop in any sport than simply putting in the time and effort. People do have ceilings. F1 drivers are a rare combination of opportunity, skill, talent and mindset that have also beaten the odds to be able to get to put all of that together. This makes it even less likely that a true sim would have any competitive players, compared to the real drivers.

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The game doesnt have to be as hard, if they created a realistic sim they can scale that down in difficulty easily, and they can tame the speed of the AI drivers. Your skill in a sim doesnt have to mimic that of a real life F1 driver in order to be competitive (against AI atleast), as the drivers deal with a lot more than braking points and throttle pressure on the track, they are essencially doing that while going for a jog, in a sauna at 190mph at 5g's.

Codemasters have just accomplished something that by todays standards for driving physics is below the par that other companies have set, going back years. In some aspects they made F1 2010 more difficult because of the way it oversteers when you're not expecting it, in an unforgiving way and without the forces being simulated by the FFB it can be very hard to feel the car, it is a learning curve in itself to drive this game just as it would be for a more hardcore sim, but yes of course it is a lot easier and far more forgiving overall.

FFB and what you feel in a real car are different things, but its the way that games/simulators have attempted to mimic the sensation of the real life forces in a car, forces that your brain uses to calculate decisions and reactions, things that a game can only relay to you through your eyes and through the wheel.

WIth F1 2010 not attempting to simulate forces through the wheel you're left with just your eyes as your sense for driving, this takes away the connection for a lot of players and that is something that takes some getting used to, especially if you have been playing alot of other sims.

Like i said, i like the game. I just see that they could have made a much better physics engine that would be able to cater for the guys who want an easy pick up and play race game, aswell as the guys that are wanting a more hardcore simulation, it can be true to life in physics without being too hard. I am an average guy, not the most experienced or skilled sim racer, yet my speed in the more realistic and more difficult sims is not much slower than it is in F1 2010, i am 95% as consistant and fast with those once i am dialed in.

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This reminded me of a favorite Top Gear clip:

Richard Hammond drives F1 Renault R25 car at Silverstone - Top Gear - BBC Autos

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=

Looks like flash being off has disabled the youtube code, just follow the link.

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Good episode, i watched that years ago, you realise that minus the neck pain and adrenaline, he would mess up just as bad in an F1 sim, id be surprised if he could keep the car in a straight line at first. as with all things in life practice makes better, dedication makes perfect (or as near as).

You cant say because a tv presenter isn't able to drive a formula ford that therefor all racing sims are unrealistic because nobody would be able to drive them in real life regardless of how good they are in the sim, which i think is what you're getting at ^^. Or atleast that if a sim was realistic to life, nobody would be able to drive them, which is so far from the truth. Richard there clearly had no confidence, and a huge margin for error if he messed up, that same car perfectly modelled in a sim would have none of that, he could crash it to his hearts desire until he mastered it and that is why a perfectly realistic car in a sim is fine, and thats why people can be competitive without being the best in the world.

Lets not forget the guys who win FVA who go to italy, train on their inhouse simulator before jumping into a formula jr series car, before jumping into an old F1 car.

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I like the game and I don't know if it's sim enough. NOONE on this board drove an f1 car so noone will ever know if it is the real deal. The f1 mods for race07 and rfactor that we play were made by some nerd in his mothers basement. The only things you can decide is, "Does it make me feel like driving the real thing?" and "does it look like it behaves in the real world?"

So it is a very subjective topic.

To me, it feels like the game has some assists running in the background that you can't turn off. You can floor the gaspedal in a straight line and you never ever will spin the car out. the wheels spin (which you can't feel other than your revs hitting the limiter), but that's about it. If you floor the pedal and turn the steering wheel, then you can spin out.

The tracks are definitely the best f1 tracks from any sim. Iracings tracks are good too, but the rfactor and race07 tracks are horrible.

The main points why I don't play the game as much is the lack of difficulty . I finished a season on legend , no assists, 30% racelength in a Virgin and won the Championship. Come on codemasters! Please have someone on the tester team who actually raced some sims!

Online gaming on the PC is also very frustrating as to not being able to see if a game is in the lobby or in race before you join it.

I can't wait for the iRacing car though to compare it to f1 2010.

If you play on PC , add me to GFWL : xBALLiNxODDTiME

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I finally bought this for PS3, since I had GT5 pre-ordered and now it's delayed. Anyway, my thoughts:

1- I wish I had a pc that would run this. I know I would enjoy the pc version more, with better wheel settings etc.

2-I suck at Bahrain, and on expert I qualify 9th with the lotus. And I mean I hate Bahrain. That is also my first try, no setup or anything. I think this game is on the easy side.

3 The lag the ISR guys with the throttle doesn't seem to be lag because the engine revs, it just does not go. It's almost like it's spinning in place or something. I adjusted my gear ratio a bit and shifted slightly earlier and it went away, but it looks like there will be no turning with the outside rear as this thing almost will not spin out of a turn, but maybe it's just the weak BHP of the Lotus.

4-Bahrain looks like it was built immediately after a forest fire and there is still a smokey haze lingering for the race. Very grey and washed looking on ps3.

5- When playing this I thought "F1CE" was better, so I put F1CE and it definitely, at least for me, was not.

6-The waves in the streets of Monaco are awesome feeling, and you can see the suspension working quite well.

7-I'm using a DFGT, so I plug in a DFP for fun. It locks at 180, like ISR said it would, so I use the code to unlock for rotation (in game press the brake, select, r3, and shift up lever simultaneously to unlock full 900). Then I messed with the linearity and was able to get a fairly comfortable 400 or so degrees of rotation recognized, but it's a little funky. With some tweaking it could be made perfect I think.

8-Includes Bernie's butchered Silverstone, which is correct but I was hoping for the old one.

Initial impression: It's good, but I almost wish I had not bought it. I have rfactor and several f1 mods, which for me are better. The game aspect of moving up rides is pretty fun, and it's not a bad game, I just .. I dunno, it's alright. 30fps is hard for me to adjust to. I turn all shadows and car detail down in rfactor to keep the frames blasting, and 30 is a little weird. Graphics are quite good, but a little washed. The tracks have alot of character and I think that is the star of the game for me so far, just as others have said (see Monaco and Brazil). These are seriously good tracks. The physics are fine but a little too forgiving on expert. I am enjoying it, though the money could have probably went to some other game and I would have been as happy with rfactor. This probably is the best console sim so far, though. I think it qualifies as a sim, for the most part, though I have no idea what driving f1 is like, but from the looks of in car vids I would at least say the rear wheels are not getting the power right out fo the corners.

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I just hate for a fact that we can't get an F1 driver to say yes or no ....what is realistic and what is missing

why is that so hard?.... I posted a video of Lewis Hamilton playing the game...except they didnt mention the game the whole time

i doubt an professional driver is going to go out of his way to badmouth a product especially one that promotes his sport ...but it would be nice to have them point out the differences in an f1 or even rally game.... what is the harm in that?

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I should say that though I really dig sims, that does not make or break a game for me. My issues with F1 2010 do not have to do with its realism, or lack of realism. I love Forza 3 and there is basically nothing realistic about that game. But it's fun and the cars and tracks look and feel good. If we are honest, the only thing that really makes a sim difficult is your competition. I mean anyone can just slow down and make any turn, but doing it faster than another human is when things get tricky.

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As people have pointed out, there are some good things about F1 2010. However, in the end there is exaggerated grip & a sort of steering assist that allows you to blast through most sections of the tracks with your accelerator pressed to the floor. The only tricky part is some of the slow corners, where the car has a tendency to spin. Once you learn & master these corners, there's not much complexity to the inputs, which is disappointing.

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How can anybody drive with that LAG in the steering. I finaly gave it a try since my rig is back up. Great looking tracks is all I can say about this GAME. :roll:

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