DSD Hydraulic Handbrake DIY Project
5 5

126 posts in this topic

ok guys, so finally all the parts have arrived for the handbrake and I've started looking at building this thing.

I've a couple of questions for those guys that have built one already:

  1. Do I really need 3/8" washers as listed in Dereks guide, what are they used for (daft question I know)?
  2. How firmly secured does the pull cylinder need to be? absolutely secure with zero movement or is some movement ok?
  3. Does the pull cylinder have to be mounted/secured in exactly the same way as Derek's, with the opposite end of the bushings shaft bolted to a bracket.  Or could I for example mount it using a clamp around the cylinder itself?
  4. Is there anything special I need to do to bleed the brake fluid through the brake lines and cylinder? - I've never done this before so don't want spillage or to stupidly miss a step

 

 

Edited by UNKLE

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

1. I think it' for the slave cylinder Bushings

2. myself and Steve used push slave cylinder. It has to be rock solid.

3. Again - push cylinder in our case and as you can see our methods are the same, but different individual materials/placement etc. I had to rework its mounting several times to make sure both the cylinder and the stopper, it pushes the rod with dampers against were mounted solid. 

4. It can and probably will be messy. I recommend doing it in a bath tub or where spillage of fluid is unimportant. It will discolour wood and probably carpets

just load the system up and having slightly unscrewed the niple, pump the lever a lot until it bleeds the air and some of the fluid and it should have almost no give when pulled Iightly after some workout. I did it only twice but you learn quickly. My tip is to cover the niple with a plastic cup or something or if not tight it will squirt

 

 

Edited by frapster

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

a few more thoughts about things that were either concerns or had to be resolved or had any importance for me

there was still way too much physical travel range on the lever, for my liking, no matter how well I bled it (even though that certainly helped).

So I used my lever's front swinging peg (whatever it's called) to prop it against a small plate (i circled it in the pic), having extended its master cylinder rod  little to compensate for the slightly pulled minimum position. That way i have some pressure applied initially, where the lever is feels very light at the start of its travel. Of course even 20% of travel translates into some pressure applied to the transducer, so I use DIView app for all my controllers ranges/deadzones etc settings to dial out those 20% (essentially a deadzone) and voilà. It works a charm and the lever is always nice and tight

Use plenty of thread sealant and/or teflon tape on all joints and connectors. Leaks are a bad thing

If using push cylinder, make sure it and whatever it presses the rod against are both solid as a rock. I had some play there in my 1st system earlier in the thread and it results in you having to apply a lot more pressure to produce same range on the axis, so the tighter and more solid it is, the better feel you'll get. That bronze looking bit i ended up with is an old steering wheel boss from a kart, adapted for the purpose and drilled to fit the occasion

 

flip_HB.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks Frapster those tips I'm sure will prove helpful.  I've a few more parts on order before I go full swing into this, should have it completed in the next week or two providing there's no hiccups.

Your hand brake is the same as mine only mine is the floor standing version with the extra long shaft.

There's one thing that's still confusing me a little in your photo.  I see you've mounted the cylinder on the bushings side. Yet Derek has his cylinder mounted on the opposite side.  Does it matter which side I mount the pull cylinder just so long as it's attached firmly?

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, UNKLE said:

There's one thing that's still confusing me a little in your photo.  I see you've mounted the cylinder on the bushings side. Yet Derek has his cylinder mounted on the opposite side.  Does it matter which side I mount the pull cylinder just so long as it's attached firmly?

Sorry, I'm afraid I must be misunderstanding your question, as I can't figure out what you mean, esp that both Derek's and mine slave cylinders are located basically in the same place (on the right of the lever assembly), not that it would matter at all

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, frapster said:

Sorry, I'm afraid I must be misunderstanding your question, as I can't figure out what you mean, esp that both Derek's and mine slave cylinders are located basically in the same place (on the right of the lever assembly), not that it would matter at all

On Derek's handbrake to the right of the bushings it's not bolted to anything, it's simply bolted on one side to the left.  On yours and Steve's the cylinder is bolted in multiple places including the right side where the bushings are.

Is this simply because you used a push cylinder and not a pull cylinder like Derek's?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, UNKLE said:

On Derek's handbrake to the right of the bushings it's not bolted to anything, it's simply bolted on one side to the left.  On yours and Steve's the cylinder is bolted in multiple places including the right side where the bushings are.

Is this simply because you used a push cylinder and not a pull cylinder like Derek's?

Yes indeed. I assume pull cylinder just pulls the rod, compressing the bushings against itself. In our case wiht push cylinders it needs something to push against- a block of aluminium in Steve's case and a kart boss in my case. I'd have probably gone for pull cylinder if i were doing this project again

Edited by frapster

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
18 minutes ago, frapster said:

Yes indeed. I assume pull cylinder just pulls the rod, compressing the bushings against itself. In our case wiht push cylinders it needs something to push against- a block of aluminium in Steve's case and a kart boss in my case. I'd have probably gone for pull cylinder if i were doing this project again

That makes sense thanks, this is all new to me

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 12/18/2015 at 5:50 PM, B20PV said:

I'm using another version of that handbrake, also with a DSD board, but a caliper instead of a slave cylinder.

Some pics:

 

Cheers!

J.J.

Absolutely amazing!

You're happy with the way it functions and feels?

Cheers

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@SteveS Thanks for the kind words, much appreciated!

@Thirsty You are too kind! I have no idea what a hydraulic handbrake feels like in real life, my vehicles were always either cable operated or foot operated.

It works well in my opinion; you can feel the pressure build up and the game reacts accordingly, it reacts the way I hoped it would. Except for the fact that the disc is stationary vs rotating i.r.l., this what I imagine it should feel like in a real car.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi guys!

I am nearly finish collecting parts for my handbrake. last of them are on the way from China.

@B20PV

My project will use same 4 piston brembo calliper. What did you use as elastomer spring? I ordered sample of 6mm hard black rubber, but on pictures I noticed something transparent. What thickness did you use? I measured gap and it's about 7mm that means if i squeeze in 8mm rubber could be no compression spring effect (same I could screw sensor directly into master piston and there be no difference) and if I slide in 6mm (like real brake disc) rubber then brake will have some dead zone (like real one) but i am not sure is it something that I want, because dead zone means slower reaction.

 

I have one more question, about switching between analog and digital mode. Some of games does not support analog handbrake. Is it possible to connect sensor with 0.5V - 4.5V range to digital input of controller? In theory everything above 2.6V is high state. Did anybody tried to switch connections pins instead of adding microswitch?

Edited by Tofi
update

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 

@B20PV

My project will use same 4 piston brembo calliper. What did you use as elastomer spring? I ordered sample of 6mm hard black rubber, but on pictures I noticed something transparent. What thickness did you use? I measured gap and it's about 7mm that means if i squeeze in 8mm rubber could be no compression spring effect (same I could screw sensor directly into master piston and there be no difference) and if I slide in 6mm (like real brake disc) rubber then brake will have some dead zone (like real one) but i am not sure is it something that I want, because dead zone means slower reaction

Hi Tofi,

I used 6mm aluminium plate as a 'disc' , there is quite a bit of deadzone, which is fine and feels ok while driving. When waiting at the start line in DirtRally I have to hold the handbrake quite hard to activate the in-game start sequence. I'm using a 1000psi sensor.

The other issue with using an aluminum disc was an annoying rattle when the caliper pistons are in rest position. I solved that by adding a small spring to force the 'disc' against the caliper.Here are some cell phone pics to explain.

IMAG2268.jpg

IMAG2266.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@B20PV I also was following by Derek's post

 


Sam Sensor (36 USD) - 1000psi only
 

 for now I will check the feelings with current sensor and if it will be as bad as you describe then change it to 500 psi.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 

@B20PV I also was following  De rek's post

 I've  now I will check the feelings with current sensor and if it will be as bad as you describe then change it to 500 psi.

IMO, you just have to eliminate any play, like I have. That gives a much better response, I realised It after several configurations i had. Tune the ranges later In software

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Here is how tight the lever is. 1000 psi as well. In DR it needs 100% application at rally starts, so I limit it to about 93% so it is slightly easier to reach full lock, otherwise your arm gets a good workout 

Mind you, this is just a personal Preference, might not reflect reality 

Edited by frapster

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thank you for advice, but like I mentioned earlier I want to use 6 pin toggle switch to changing between analog and digital modes. In this case is important that sensor have to reach voltage high enough to toggle logic gate at arduino board.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
5 5